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| 3 Bayonets (India) http://forum.bajonet.be/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=828 |
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| Auteur: | Orita [ 17 sep 2008, 05:23 ] |
| Berichttitel: | 3 Bayonets (India) |
- I have in my collection 3 bayonets manufactured during WW2 in India: two of them are the model "MkII" and one is the model "MkIII". All 3 bayonets have these dimensions: => Overall length = 425mm; => Blade length = 304mm; => Blade width [at crossguard] = 23mm. These bayonets are for the .303 SMLE No1MkIII Lee-Enfield bolt action rifle [ see it here at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lee-Enfield ] which fires the .303 rimmed cartridge [7.7X56R]. I have 2 of these rifles, one made in 1918 in England and the other made in 1942 in Australia, both weapons fire very well. Three of my pictures will be posted here. ---> Photo 1: TOP => The bayonet from left and the one from the middle are both the model "MkII" made in 1943. The bayonet from right is the model "MkIII" and it was made in 1944. Note that the blades have no fullers. BOTTOM => You can see the handles of these bayonets in the same order ["MkII" at left and in the middle, "MkIII" at right]. Both "MkII" bayonets have the crossguard marked "DP" [Drill Purpose] and a circular white band 14mm wide is visible on the wooden grips. The bayonet from right is different, the pommel has a squared shape and the wooden grips have parallel sides. This bayonet is the model "MkIII" but it is wrongly marked also "MkII". All the 3 bayonets have the wooden grips secured in place to the blade tang with 2 screws and 2 nuts. ---> Photo 2: This photo shows from a close distance the markings stamped on the left ricasso blade of the "MkIII" bayonet [the one from right]. The meaning of these markings is: "G.R.I" ["Georgius Rex Imperator" for King George VI of England, 1937-1952]; "MkII" [bayonet model wrongly marked, it should be stamped "MkIII"]; "12 44" [date of bayonet manufacture, December 1944]; "R.F.I" [the maker's mark, "Rifle Factory Ishapore" / India]. Note the yellow color at the bottom where the crosspiece was brazed to the bayonet blade. ---> NOTE: A) I don't have the original leather scabbards for these bayonets. B) All these 3 bayonets have the blade tip very sharp, too sharp considering that 2 bayonets ["MkII" with the circular white band around the wooden grips] were for Drill Purpose [and clearly stamped "DP" on the crossguard]. Orita 09/17/08 |
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| Auteur: | virjinz [ 17 sep 2008, 07:35 ] |
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| Auteur: | Orita [ 18 sep 2008, 04:54 ] |
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- I forgot to mention a couple of things in my initial comments: => 1) All the 3 bayonets also have typical Ishapore inspection marks [the letters "IS" over a two or three digit number] stamped on the right ricasso blade. => 2) The unfullered blade of these bayonets have a so called "false edge" to the point which means that a portion of the back edge of the blade to the tip is sharpened. Orita 09/17/08 |
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| Auteur: | Kilian [ 20 sep 2008, 00:31 ] |
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These often show up without scabbard. I wonder where they have gone. |
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| Auteur: | Orita [ 20 sep 2008, 05:31 ] |
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- @ Kilian: I've never seen for sale the original leather scabbards for these Indian WW2 made bayonets. If I'm not wrong, the leather scabbards may look like the scabbards for the Patt.1907 bayonets made in England [excepting the length]. Orita 09/20/08 |
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| Auteur: | jdeleur [ 20 sep 2008, 11:02 ] |
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If i'm correct the scabbards are brownish in color just like the 1907 ones found in Afghanistan. |
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| Auteur: | Orita [ 20 sep 2008, 19:18 ] |
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- @ Kilian & jdeleur: According with the book I have and named "British & Commonwealth Bayonets" [authors: Ian D. Skennerton & Robert Richardson], in 1926 in India the bayonet nomenclature was changed and the British Patt.1907 bayonet became "No.1 Bayonet". The scabbards issued by India for the bayonets you see in my "Photo 1" from above were in fact shortened scabbards of the "No.1 Bayonet" [former Patt.1907]. Orita 09/20/08 |
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| Auteur: | Kilian [ 03 okt 2008, 20:08 ] |
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Orita schreef: - @ Kilian & jdeleur: According with the book I have and named "British & Commonwealth Bayonets" [authors: Ian D. Skennerton & Robert Richardson], in 1926 in India the bayonet nomenclature was changed and the British Patt.1907 bayonet became "No.1 Bayonet". The scabbards issued by India for the bayonets you see in my "Photo 1" from above were in fact shortened scabbards of the "No.1 Bayonet" [former Patt.1907]. Orita 09/20/08 Yes, I know how the scabbard for these looks: Shortened P1907 and so far I´ve only seen them in black. You see them occasionally offered with the scabbard, but my point was that there seems to be a great quantity of these on the marked that are without scabbard. I see more without than with the scabbard. I was just wondering where these might have gone. Lost due to wear in use, re-used for some other bayonet (although I wouldn´t know for which one then), more bayonets made than scabbards, simply scrapped, or perhaps there is somewhere a containerload of scabbards waiting to be found? |
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